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The mighty .338 Lapua Mag. This is how I would balance the sniper rifles in a shooter. All of the battle rifles could easily be built to be DMR, but they would never have the lethality of a true sniper rifle. The idea here is to take out the run and gun sniper stuff we see. They basically have a one shot kill gun but they use it like an assault rifle. By making the gun virtually useless on the move (or while in any position other than prone really), that problem is solved. On the flip side of the coin, the gun is very useful when used properly - prone gives the player perfect stability since the bi-pod will be deployed and kneeling is better than standing). Essentially there would be so much movement while using the gun standing, and even more while moving, AND finding the target again after taking a shot would take far too long to be useful; that no one would be successful using it for run and gun.

Something that always baffles me is when video game designers somehow conclude that the .308 sniper rifle they put in the game is more powerful than the .308 battle rifle they have also included in the game or that they magically hold fewer rounds than they should in order to balance out the score card. Then of course we have the .50 cal rifles that mysteriously don't do the kind of damage that they actually do. They apparently believe that a person would actually be able to continue fighting after being hit by a SEVEN HUNDRED grain projectile. Or that body armor actually protects from .50BMG. Same goes for .338LM. There is no surviving a hit from these guns in Gunfighter. The best a player can hope for is to hit the ground and need to be rescued by a team mate. There is a much greater probability that if you are hit in the upper torso you're a dead man, and of course head shots are instant death.

I would also have an "accessory" for the snipers, available only for the Sniper scope which figures bullet drop and illuminates the proper place on the reticule.

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August 11, 2012
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:iconthelivingredbaron:
~TheLivingRedBaron Sep 6, 2012  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
No-scope Barrett kills are a no-go. I've handled that weapon, and most of the others featured in CoD. I get so mad that I cannot kill some one as well with any of the weapons I would really use down-range. I would stick with my cut-down 870/SRM1216 and heavily customized colt vest pocket. Short and shortest, perfect for room clearing duty, and eliminating corner campers...
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:iconcityofthesouth:
Another reason I want a game with bots. In this game, where you won't be able to take many rounds before going down, human players would of course find ways to exploit it. I realize there are hardcore modes in many games, but what happens is that the ways human players find to manipulate the game are just that much more annoying when you can't take many hits. You try to be careful, but given the limited field of view in FPS games, run and gunners essentially drive the tactics of all the other players. In order to stay alive, you must also become a run and gunner because moving slowly and carefully gets you killed about as often as it does anything beneficial for you. With bots you are allowed you use the tactics you like. ANYWAY that was kind of a side rant. I *think* the beauty of the weapon system I've put together is that you can easily build guns that work for you, like your CQB style. I didn't post the short barrel ARs but I talked about them. I did draw them though so I'll post them one day.
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:iconthelivingredbaron:
~TheLivingRedBaron Sep 7, 2012  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
If this game ever comes together, I will be first in line to pick it up, even if it becomes a-ahem-pc game. Any game in which room clearing is as fast paced as it should be is a winner. There should be a whole map that takes place like inside a hotel, with ALOT of rooms, with doors you can close and breach. that would be beyond cool. I love door breaching, its a lot of thrill, with the unknown dangers on the other side and all.
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:iconcityofthesouth:
that would be awesome. I think to make the gun system even better the maps have to be designed around the game. Like you said, there needs to be maps that are pure CQB and then others that require more range so that there is more need to configure different guns for different locations.
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:iconthelivingredbaron:
~TheLivingRedBaron Sep 11, 2012  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
Also you should keep battlefield's ability to customize loadouts during gameplay. that way, when your tactics change, your gear follows suit.

What direction are you going with explosives and launchers? Am I going to be able to force entry with a breaching charge that stands in for my frag? How about actually blowing holes in the wall with Semtex? Speaking of door breaching, how about hinge-breaking muzzle attachments for shotties?
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:iconcityofthesouth:
My concept is really about the shooting aspect, AND I don't want it to feel like a military shooter. It would be better to think of it like playing some kind of private contractor in whatever context, doesn't matter. It wouldn't be a "Russia" vs the "US" kind of game or whatever other enemy. It would be more like this faction vs this faction in a more or less fictional environment. The point is to free the player up to look and kit up however he/she wants to. The "character" wouldn't necessarily have access to things like grenades or whatever. It's more personal and it's more character vs character or player vs player. In an online multiplayer version (which I am not thinking of when I think of Gunfighter) it would really be your own personal character, kitted up however you like, vs other people doing the same. It's more YOU vs the enemy whoever they might be. I don't want players changing kit in the middle of a fight. I'm not even sure I accept them changing to another complete loadout. The point is, get ready BEFORE you show up. The game would provide you with the information you need to know before hand so that your weapon and cammo make sense. It is useful in Battlefield when you need to take out a tank for instance, but we won't have tanks. For a little dose of reality, there is no magically busting out the piece of gear you need in the middle of a foreign land.

That mostly answers your second question I think. Explosives and launchers would either be nonexistent or I would need to build a system for them specifically. There will be no use for launchers so they aren't likely going to show up. I do like the idea of breaching so I would be open to include semtex that can only be attached to walls and doors, not thrown or left laying around. In fact if I were to include stuff like that it would probably be mission specific. Like you HAVE to blow open a door/wall just to get in. What I don't want to see is bots tossing perfectly timed and aimed frags, or "sticky" grenades - whoever dreamed that crap up. No using C4 to "troll snipers". Most of this stuff is complete loops that won't exist anyway. Snipers are annoying because players abuse the lack of realism to become overly effective with sniper rifles. The pissed off victims then grab C4, sneak up on the annoying sniper and detonate him. Or if you're me, you use rocket launchers to take care of snipers, which BTW is precisely how our armed forces deal with them. Anyway, if the sniper rifles are more useful when used properly, then we don't have so much annoyance and probably have less trolling to begin with. This game isn't going to be for people who think it's funny to get knife kills, or kill other players in "creative" ways, or simply abuse holes in the game design in order to win. It's all about the fight and teamwork, since it would be a two player game. Anyway, sorry for the long answer but there it is.
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:iconthelivingredbaron:
Mood: Daily Needs ~TheLivingRedBaron Sep 13, 2012  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
Right on.
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:iconrunning-ricketts:
~Running-Ricketts Aug 12, 2012  Student Digital Artist
I would argue that you could get a good shot off while kneeling or standing if you have time to steady your shot. Although large sniper rifles are best fired from a prone position if you have time to steady your self and your life counts on it you could be accurate while standing even if it would be less desired to lying prone. I do agree with you though that you just can't run with these rifles let along expect to use them while on the move. I still can't wait to see the game where a .50BMG destroys a person and sends them flying from where they were standing instead of just making them flinch.
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:iconcityofthesouth:
yeah I agree. I would be incorporating some amount of wobble (or whatever you want to call it) when the gun is brought up to shoot for all of the guns. Sniper rifles would just have the most of it. A single shot could certainly be made, but recovering from the recoil would take the longest and be the most dramatic of any gun in the game. That seems realistic to me and would help eliminate misuse. The bottom line I'm working at is that a large number of game players (myself included in lots of ways) find ways to misuse the weapons, equipment and the environment to help them win.

I would also build maps specifically for the use of snipers and like I've said before, reward players for using them correctly. Give them good opportunities, make the guns very effective when used correctly, just make it fun and rewarding. I think it would also be pretty cool if the snipers were the only way to find enemies without seeing them yourself. Like maybe they could spot them and their position would then appear on the other player's map.
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:iconrunning-ricketts:
~Running-Ricketts Aug 13, 2012  Student Digital Artist
That all sounds very good. I especially like they idea of snipers only being able to "spot" enemies.
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